Jo Swinson

India - Westminster Hall Debate

Jo Swinson (East Dunbartonshire, Liberal Democrat): It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr. Sheridan, particularly as it is your debut outing in the role. I am sure that it will be the first of many. I congratulate Mr. Amess on not only leading the delegation, but securing the debate and introducing it so comprehensively. However, one and a half hours is a short time to discuss something as huge as India-the world's largest democracy-and I am sure that we could easily have filled three hours, if not more.

I thank all of those who created the opportunity for parliamentarians to visit India and see first hand the experience of British businesses in India and those Indian businesses that are having such an impact on the UK economy. The Industry and Parliament Trust provides a vital link between business and Parliament. It was a fascinating and useful trip that greatly added to my understanding of both business and India.

As mentioned by Ian Stewart, I speak on foreign affairs for the Liberal Democrats and, indeed, this was my first experience of India. I was particularly keen to experience that country to widen my understanding of the foreign affairs role. A little bit of me fell in love with India. I have visited various countries and although India is often compared to China-both countries are talked of in terms of competition and in discussions about growth-I, frankly, found India much more inspiring. Many of the reasons behind that relate to the fact that India is the world's largest democracy. The biggest difference between experiencing China and experiencing India is the freedom that individuals have. Both countries have huge problems, but the ability of ordinary Indians to be entrepreneurial and dynamic comes across from when one lands at the airport to when one walks down the street. Indeed, that also came across in all the meetings that we held.

In terms of an overall impression, India has obviously grown rapidly-by about 8 or 9 per cent. each year since 2003, although that is slightly dipping now. Wherever one goes in India, it is apparent that it is a country of contrasts: between rural isolation and urban sprawl, lavish riches and people who are literally dirt poor, and an economy driven by a vast array of young people, who also have a huge respect for wisdom and old age. It is a dynamic and bustling country and the sheer energy of it nearly knocks one down. There is a sensory overload of colours, noise and smells- particularly in a city such as Mumbai. Most of all, India comes across as a country that is keen to innovate and has entrepreneurial spirit. That is why it is clear that it is not only a key global power now, but that it will only grow in influence in the years to come.

I want to share what I thought was one of the most inspiring visits, which was when we went to see the sheriff of Mumbai, Dr. Indu Shahani, who is a formidable, forceful and friendly woman. She is very positive and embracing, and is indeed, I suspect, a strong role model for other women in the city. By profession, she is a teacher so we met her at a college. With 50 per cent. of the population under 25, education is vital for India's future development. Dr. Indu Shahani told us about a scholarship scheme that was being set up with the university of Westminster to send four girls to London to study. A delegation of academics from the university were in Mumbai on 26 November to discuss the scheme. They were to meet the shortlist of eight girls from which the final four would be chosen. They were near the Taj hotel at about 10 o'clock at night and they heard shots being fired just as they were leaving their meetings. There was obviously a degree of confusion, but most of the delegation of academics were prevented from going back to the Taj hotel where they were booked in to stay. Instead, they were taken to the homes of members of the Indian staff to spend the night. Sadly, two of the academics had gone on ahead and went back into the hotel just at the wrong moment. One of them was shot, although fortunately they recovered and are now fine.

Obviously, for an Indian college trying to put together a scholarship scheme, it was hugely worrying that such an incident would have a negative impact. However-this speaks wonders about the university of Westminster and made me feel quite proud to be British-the university said that, as a gesture of solidarity, it would extend the scholarship scheme to all eight girls on the shortlist, rather than just offer it to four. Indeed, two of those girls came from the slums. That is an example of the type of work going on between India and the UK, and shows that it is perhaps in the most difficult moments that the friendship between the two countries is strongest.

We were obviously in India to visit various businesses. I was struck by the strong commitment to corporate social responsibility that others have mentioned. That concept seems to be much more ingrained in Indian business than it is in many British businesses. Tata was perhaps most impressive in that respect. Its business has a long history of being part of the community, although it has forthcoming challenges in terms of sustainability and climate change. The launch of the Nano will be followed by the Europa, which will be a similar model with lower emissions launched in Europe.

It was hugely helpful to have Baroness Coussins with us because she has a strong background in CSR. When we visited Hindustan Unilever Limited, it told us that its motto was, "Doing well by doing good." HSBC talked to us about its financial inclusion education programmes, environmental sustainability and how it is training women to be entrepreneurs. It used the words "corporate sustainability", which might find their way into the UK lexicon in relation to this matter. Corporate sustainability is a different approach. It is not an add-on, a public relations strategy or something that will simply look good in a glossy brochure; it is about the entire way that a business operates.

When on a trip, the most striking things are not always found on the programmed activities; they are often found when one gets away from the scheduled meetings. Some colleagues and I went for a wander around one of the slums in Chennai. Frankly, watching "Slumdog Millionaire" does not prepare one for seeing that level of poverty. Walking past the chop shop where they put different bits of cars together, I thought that if it were in Britain health and safety would have a field day with what was left lying around the road, and, of course, there was no running water or sanitation. However, when we walked down the street, children were excited and talked to us-their basic English was quite good. They have so little, but they are almost unaware that they have so little. It is difficult to go through that experience without feeling a huge sense of guilt. That experience was for me very profound.

Similarly, in Mumbai, we saw places that were basically shacks with no sanitation. However, we then walked down the street and saw that a street party was going on. At such parties, there is a tradition of getting paste and coloured dye and throwing it over everyone with hilarity and joyfulness. There is a challenge in seeing such intense poverty, but it is also inspiring to see the positive attitude that goes alongside that. That is one of the things that will stand India in good stead.

Obviously, the UK has a history of close ties with India. Indeed, that came through in a meeting with Cadbury, which is an historic brand in India. It has a 70 per cent. share-most businesses would be chuffed with that-of the chocolate market. I was intrigued to learn that chocolate has to be made to a different formulation in India. A different level of milk fat is required so that chocolate does not melt until it is at 35(o), whereas apparently Cadbury chocolate in the UK melts at 28(o). That is an interesting fact that stuck in my brain.

The relationship between the UK and India has been important and will be important in the future, but we need to guard against complacency and thinking that we will always be close because of our long history. There are increasingly close ties between the United States and India as more and more young Indians go to US universities to study. Indeed, it is often the older Indians who have a strong attachment to the UK.

History is not enough. We need to encourage more Indians to study here, which is why the activities in India of the British Council, which we met, are so important. Coming back to the purpose of our visit, that is also why the activities of British businesses working in India and Indian businesses working in the UK are a wonderful way to integrate the two countries for our mutual benefit in the future.